Better poisons mod

Talk about the mods or features you'd like to see in Daggerfall Unity. Give mod creators some ideas!
Jay_H
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Better poisons mod

Post by Jay_H »

The incredible danger posed by enemy poison in Daggerfall demands a strategy of either immunity or real-life luck. At later levels poison damage can become unbearable, not to mention the irritation caused by mysteriously reduced stats which many characters have trouble restoring.

A poison mod would only need to alter one file: https://github.com/Interkarma/daggerfal ... nEffect.cs
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daggerdude
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by daggerdude »

sounds pretty neat man!

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jayhova
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by jayhova »

A thing that tells you have been poisoned before you go to sleep would be nice. Poisons are way to fast acting. In Daggerfall you can be killed all but instantly with a poison.
Remember always 'What would Julian Do?'.
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BansheeXYZ
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by BansheeXYZ »

We do see a lot of confusion caused by poison. Totally agree that it's a bad mechanic. Players either don't know they're poisoned or they do, but can't gauge its effects during rest or travel, resulting in cheap deaths.

You know the "You are healthy" message that appears after time and place when pressing "I"? This is totally out of place and belongs on the character sheet, just like Magicka. There should be a line that says "Status: Healthy" that changes to "Diseased" and/or "Poisoned", which you can hover over to see what specific poison you are afflicted with and what it does. Because you can only fix something if you know it's there and you can only know how dangerous it is if you know what it does.

Poison should decline hp 3x as fast and change the bar from red to green. When this happens during battle, it adds an element of excitement, panic, and strategy. It also makes it obvious when you're poisoned, giving the player the opportunity to cure it. This slow, invisible poison stuff that Daggerfall does is boring and confusing. It never results in satisfying deaths and you end up blaming the game instead of your own procrastinations and gambles.

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Ralzar
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by Ralzar »

I think a lot of the problem with Poison is that you don't know what's happening or how it affects you.
If it listed what kind of poison, what effects it had, duration and suggestions on how to cure it, it would be better. The problem is really when you just suddenly have debuffed attributes and the game can't inform why why that is or how to fix it. It feels like a bug.

It's also really weird that the only ways are by getting a high enough rank in a temple or doing some hacky spellcasting. "Cure Disease" in temples should really just be "Cure" and handle both disease and poison.
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Hazelnut
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by Hazelnut »

Ralzar wrote: Mon Oct 14, 2019 9:19 am I think a lot of the problem with Poison is that you don't know what's happening or how it affects you.
If it listed what kind of poison, what effects it had, duration and suggestions on how to cure it, it would be better. The problem is really when you just suddenly have debuffed attributes and the game can't inform why why that is or how to fix it. It feels like a bug.

It's also really weird that the only ways are by getting a high enough rank in a temple or doing some hacky spellcasting. "Cure Disease" in temples should really just be "Cure" and handle both disease and poison.
There are also potions of cure poison that you can purchase or mix, although you have to have reached the appropriate rank in a guild that offers those services.
See my mod code for examples of how to change various aspects of DFU: https://github.com/ajrb/dfunity-mods

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Ralzar
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by Ralzar »

From https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Daggerfall:Poison


Cures
Curing a poisoning is only possible by consuming a Cure Poison potion, or casting a spell (circinate or self-made) with a Cure Poison effect. However, while the poison will no longer be actively harming you, these cures will not restore any attribute damage you have already suffered.

Is this fixed in DFU? If so, if potions were easier to buy, that would solve it.
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Hazelnut
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by Hazelnut »

Pretty sure when I used a cure poison potion, my attributes were fixed too - but I wasn't paying enough attention to be sure. Looking at the code, the entire poison effect bundle is removed so I suspect DFU has fixed the issue.
See my mod code for examples of how to change various aspects of DFU: https://github.com/ajrb/dfunity-mods

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Leeux
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by Leeux »

You can use enchanted items with cure poison too ("x of Venom Antidote"), and they're quite common drop, relatively speaking... still, it requires you to be lucky in finding one early, or farming some of the quest that give enchanted items as reward, or be high level enough with the MG to be able to at least purchase Magic items.

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Ralzar
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Re: Better poisons mod

Post by Ralzar »

I actually ran head-first into this problem yesterday. While in a dungeon I got poisoned with attribute debuffs. I had to leave the dungeon and fail the quest.
I had no magic items with poison cure, I had no temple membership and not enough spell points to cast cure poison. My attributes were too debuffed for dungeon crawling. (And I only play with one savegame, so no loading back before getting poisoned)
So I wound up joining a temple and spending an hour or two just grinding my way up the ladder until I unlocked the potion seller, bought a Cure Poison and fixed myself.

In a way it's kind of cool to get problems that require some serious work to solve, but it also feels like a bug. If the poisoned condition would just stop at some point it would be fine. Or if there was a more predictable source of cure poison, that would also solve it. For example, if alchemists sold Cure Poison and Cure Disease at much higher prices than the temples, so you could right away see a natural path to fixing the problem. Without the Daggerfall wiki I would have had no idea I needed a high temple rank (in the right kind of temple) to get this fixed.

Edit: Btw, looking at the file linked in OP, I see there are several types of poisones. It would be really nice if the status popup didn't just change to "You are poisoned". But actually informed you what type of poison, effects and its duration. Even if it was just a vague "You have Droth Weed poisoning. It reduces your agility, speed and strength. The effects will last for 7 days"
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"I feel like Ralzar specifically wrote those mods for me and then said "Use them". Just so he could watch me die more."
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