Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

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King of Worms
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by King of Worms » Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:28 pm

Igor wrote:I tried to replace the bat sprites.
Has it any animation windows? Also, how is your texture pack working now, with Texture Compression option?

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Igor
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by Igor » Wed Feb 07, 2018 2:10 pm

King of Worms wrote: Has it any animation windows?
I'm sorry, no. I do not have time for this.
King of Worms wrote: Also, how is your texture pack working now, with Texture Compression option?
The consumption of memory has decreased significantly and everything is working now faster. The option of texture compression violates the texture seamlessness. I observe the boundaries between textures. So I do not use it.

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Igor
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by Igor » Wed Feb 07, 2018 2:22 pm

Animation is not too good, since the standard four-frame daggerfall frames are too small. For smoothness, you need more frames. But I'm afraid that then it will become too fast or too slow.

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Igor
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by Igor » Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:52 pm

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Interkarma
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by Interkarma » Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:41 pm

That imp looks badass, great work.

It's a shame about the limited frames right now. Ideally it would be possible to inject entirely new anim sets for each group (idle, attack, etc.) with any number of frames and define the animation speeds. Hopefully that's something that happens eventually for mods like this one. It's bit more of an engineering challenge than 1:1 swaps however.

I noticed your comment about texture compression breaking texture seamlessness. It might be beneficial if we allow modded sprites to enable compression independently of other textures one day. As they don't tile, compression seams should not be an issue for sprites. Even at low frame counts, larger sprite textures can turn out quite memory hungry.

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Igor
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by Igor » Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:56 am

Interkarma wrote:That imp looks badass, great work.

It's a shame about the limited frames right now. Ideally it would be possible to inject entirely new anim sets for each group (idle, attack, etc.) with any number of frames and define the animation speeds. Hopefully that's something that happens eventually for mods like this one. It's bit more of an engineering challenge than 1:1 swaps however.
On the one hand, yes. But on the other hand, the increase in the number of frames increases exponentially the amount of work. You need to prepare animations for the front view for the rear view and for the view from the sides. Ideally, all flats should be replaced with normal 3D objects.

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Interkarma
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by Interkarma » Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:41 am

That all depends on the individual, I think. My personal ideal is repaints around Battlespire's level of detail, and I will always prefer sprites over 3D models in Daggerfall.

That's the nice thing about an open project like this one however. I'll take project where I believe it needs to go with a good baseline of gameplay and mod support by 1.0. From there, the community can grow it organically in any number of directions. I wouldn't be surprised if we see fully rigged models in place of enemy sprites one day, but that won't be one of my initiatives.

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NikitaTheTanner
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by NikitaTheTanner » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:27 pm

As much as I want to agree with Interkarma on sprites being superior, their implementation just comes with so many disadvantages! The only plus side is that the game utilizes sprites by default and going from 2D to 3D NPCs might be a bit of a pain, especially figuring out how to do it in a way, that would make future work easier for mod makers, a more customizable system instead of simple replacer(especially with humanoids - choose race, face, equipment, etc.).

But on the other hand, Daggerfall enemy sprites are pre-rendered models, in any case it would require a 3D Model with animation first to replace them. Then, you need to create an animated spritesheet from all possible angles. In the end, the result is good and aesthetically pleasing, but limiting - you are essentially doing all the work for 3D models, but don't get any 3D model advantages out of it.

3D models can be altered at any point, sprites will need you to render all the frames again. 3D models can have more sophisticated physics, ragdolls, etc. Finally, 3D models give better sense of scale for larger creatures like Giants, Gargoyles, maybe even dragons or what not.

I see how 2D sprites might be preferred from the aesthetic point of view, but I think that 3D offers just too many advantages to modders, plus requires less work once the coding part is implemented. Though I understand, that coding to make Daggerfall support full 3D won't be an easy undertaking, I still think it would be worth it in the long run.

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Interkarma
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by Interkarma » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:31 pm

I didn't say they were superior. I said they were my personal preference in Daggerfall. I don't have any more to add, and I'm not going to argue for a point I never actually made. Please don't try to draw me into that. :)

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NikitaTheTanner
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Re: Grafon: low quality hi-res textures replacement

Post by NikitaTheTanner » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:42 pm

Yeah, that's cool! No point arguing! Even as it is, DFUnity is awesome! Just giving some thoughts as to why I think it could be cool to see 3D models some day. Maybe some high quality sprites as well, why not? Cheers ;)

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