Open: Dungeon Water Height

Need something opened in the core for your mod, or even help with research?
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LypyL
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby LypyL » Wed May 04, 2016 4:28 am

I wrote a little script to put together some of the various data from the different location / DFBlock structs. I'm going to sleep soon so I won't be able to do much else with it, but I was able to find the dungeon with the most water blocks in daggerfall - Isle of Balfiera/The Sahulessa Hermitage - has 4 water blocks (it's nothing but border blocks and water blocks, nasty :lol: ). It might be a good place to work with.
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Interkarma
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby Interkarma » Wed May 04, 2016 5:00 am

Cheers mate. That is definitely a nasty dungeon for the RNG to spit out. :D

I've also tried a few more experiments hacking in water blocks to different dungeons, and have confirmed the water height is consistent to the block itself, not the dungeon. For example, W0000000.RDB and W0000023.RDB both have very different water heights and those heights stay the same no matter which dungeon I hack that block into.

So just need to find that setting in the binary data and confirm by modding water level in game. I've worked through the known unknowns without any luck so far. Feels like just a matter of time and patience now.
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Interkarma
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby Interkarma » Wed May 04, 2016 12:24 pm

Just floating an idea to see if it holds water (pun mode enabled).

What if this is a lot simpler than first thought? Check out the following two water blocks. Wx29 on the left and Wx00 on the right.

Image

These two blocks are one of the tallest and one of the shortest respectively. In game space, the taller block has a lower water level than the shorter block. But in local space the water level appears to be the same relative to the bottom of the block.

I've tested around half of the water blocks in game, and so far the main variable influencing water level seems to be the height of the block itself.

This could just be a case of correlation != causation, but I've worked through modding unknown data several times and nothing seems to explicitly control the water level. A simple offset from bottom of block wouldn't need any other data, which could explain why that data is so hard to find.

I'm going to test this idea out thoroughly when I can. It could be wildly wrong (I've been wrong lots of times before solving something), but it's still valuable to think out loud sometimes.
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LypyL
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby LypyL » Wed May 04, 2016 2:11 pm

Sounds like a good theory! If you find that almost all blocks have the same offset, look at the unknown1 value of DFBlock.RdbBlock.Header. It's 260 for like 95% of blocks, but then there are a few 258s and maybe some others that I haven't seen (if it's the same for every block, then ignore this :) )

Assuming that would be in inches from the bottom of the block to the water level, it seems to be correct (just estimating it with some planes in unity).

http://i.imgur.com/JtkVsoX.png

Worst case scenario, there are only like 30 water blocks - it will be easy enough to work out the water height for each :D
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LypyL
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby LypyL » Wed May 04, 2016 3:08 pm

I feel confident that this is how it works now - I just remembered the special block with water in it in Cast Daggerfall Sx0160 (that's important on it's own I guess, that some special blocks have water...)

Sx0160 has an Unknown1 value of 292, which I haven't seen anywhere else. That puts the water height right here (represented by the ugly plane), which is where it is in Daggerfall.
http://i.imgur.com/AwWT3Fi.png

edit hmmm...maybe not. The numbers seem to match for the blocks I've tried, but changing the values in Blocks.BSA doesn't seem to have any effect in Daggerfall.
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Jay_H
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby Jay_H » Thu Jul 28, 2016 8:50 pm

I don't know if this is helpful, but in a dungeon I realized how the water level is decided.

This block is likely familiar; it's the half-submerged tower block. On the right is a door to a new block.

Before crossing over into the new block, the water level persists. After crossing over, the water level changes. The same effect is visible if looking back into the tower block; it'll be dry until the door is crossed.

This tells that the water level is decided by each block as the character enters it.
Come give your feedback on the ideas in my general thread, and share your DFU characters in the character thread.
Quest-writing tutorial here. Guide for new Daggerfall players here. Daggerfall Mechanics thread here.
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Nystul
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby Nystul » Mon Aug 08, 2016 10:13 am

did the daggerfall automap highlight underwater section or showed them as underwater sections somehow? can't remember and test right now
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LypyL
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby LypyL » Mon Aug 08, 2016 8:11 pm

I just checked, and it doesn't.
R.D.
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Re: Open: Dungeon Water Height

Postby R.D. » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:20 pm

We've got this one now, so it needn't be Open anymore.

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