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Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 6:17 am
by pango
I quickly checked the 4 CDs of HB's, they contain lots of cartoony practical sound effects, then fourth CD contains modern age sounds (cars, airplanes, phones...) that have no place in Daggerfall fantasy world.
So beside more animal sounds (Tigers, Cats, Cockatoo, Bears, Alligators, Birds, Crickets, Horse, Goat, "Cyclops",...) and maybe some water/swiming sounds (that are harder to recognize) I don't think those CDs are used for much else; Other sound effects must come from other sources...
jayhova wrote: ↑Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:58 am
When can we look forward to hearing hi resolution versions of these in daggerfall
Personally I don't own this sounds collection...
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 7:27 am
by jayhova
Are the MP3 versions online superior to the in game versions? I would of course like to see wav versions or other lossless compression versions.
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:28 pm
by Azteca
jayhova wrote: ↑Wed Apr 10, 2019 7:27 am
Are the MP3 versions online superior to the in game versions? I would of course like to see wav versions or other lossless compression versions.
It's a community workshop. Grab the sound clips in the OP, dig through the links on the last page and report back!
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:42 pm
by Jay_H
This is a bit more complicated than most matters we deal with. The graphics and text and so on were created directly by Bethesda, so they had the right to release them for free. But they bought the sounds from other people. The fact that the sounds were included in Daggerfall doesn't automatically give us a legal right to ownership or manipulation of the sounds.
If someone wants to make the case for abandonware that's up to them, but since the sound files come from some creative entity other than Bethesda, it isn't as simple as ripping the HQ versions from an on-line archive. I for one have no idea what foundation there is for a Hanna-Barbera sound set from 1993 to be uploaded to archive.org as public domain files.
I'm saying this in reference to the last 3 or so posts, not this whole topic. I'm assuming a cleaned soundclips set, used derivatively from Daggerfall for Daggerfall, is not a legal battle.
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:59 pm
by Azteca
Good point, Jay. If we can determine that those collections were intended as royalty free, then one could just purchase a copy and use them freely. That was the point with most of these collections: a media production house would buy them and use them in commercial projects. But worth investigating.
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:01 pm
by Azteca
Welp, it is royalty free. That's good!
But the cost...is not.
https://www.sound-ideas.com/Product/409 ... s-library/
Used copies should be available for much less and should include the same legal rights.
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:02 pm
by Jay_H
$495
Maybe they'd have a discount for their really old, outdated copies? Like buying an old textbook? I guess someone would have to talk to them directly and I'm just theorizing.
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:04 pm
by King of Worms
Good find of the 4 cds
Good joke on the 500 usd cost
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:05 pm
by jayhova
Jay_H wrote: ↑Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:42 pm
This is a bit more complicated than most matters we deal with. The graphics and text and so on were created directly by Bethesda, so they had the right to release them for free. But they bought the sounds from other people. The fact that the sounds were included in Daggerfall doesn't automatically give us a legal right to ownership or manipulation of the sounds.
If someone wants to make the case for abandonware that's up to them, but since the sound files come from some creative entity other than Bethesda, it isn't as simple as ripping the HQ versions from an on-line archive. I for one have no idea what foundation there is for a Hanna-Barbera sound set from 1993 to be uploaded to archive.org as public domain files.
I'm saying this in reference to the last 3 or so posts, not this whole topic. I'm assuming a cleaned soundclips set, used derivatively from Daggerfall for Daggerfall, is not a legal battle.
I spoke to an attorney specifically on this matter. His opinion is as follows: Sound Ideas would likely have no cause for action for a number of reasons.
- Any licence (if in fact such a licence exists at all) to use specific sounds in a product has already been paid and replacement of those sounds with versions of higher fidelity would not violate said licence
- No actual damages would be incurred because the royalty free nature of the sounds prevents the charging or demanding of royalties for the same sound in the same location and no monetary loss can be shown to exist
- The sound clips are currently listed as public domain by a reliable source (Internet archive) and this claim has not been challenged and failing to do so constitutes abandonment.
- Any action to remedy the above abandonment could not include DFU because any action taken by the members of this community would be in good faith
- Use of these materials is limited and is likely covered under fair use (The community is not redistributing the library)
- Even if Sound Ideas were inclined to pursue a case internationally, damages would be so limited that the case would not be worth prosecuting.
In short there is every reason to believe that it perfectly legal to use these sounds.
Re: [MOD] Cleaned SoundClips
Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:49 pm
by Jay_H
jayhova wrote: ↑Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:05 pm
The sound clips are currently listed as public domain by a reliable source (Internet archive) and this claim has not been challenged and failing to do so constitutes abandonment.
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I find your reasoning to be very well-founded except in this one point. Internet Archive, in my opinion, should not be trusted as an authoritative source for copyright; I've found many creative works under active copyright that people decided to upload just for the lulz.
My subconscious, and unrelated to DFU, concern was that people could transfer the sound files from DFU to some other project. Somehow I contaminated my other thoughts on that matter with that worry, for no reason.
The attorney was likely referring to the
doctrine of first sale, which is a good focal point to use for consideration. I don't find any other flaws in the reasoning.