Disguise as a concept

Talk about the mods you'd like to see in Daggerfall Unity. Give mod creators some ideas!
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Regnier
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2019 6:26 am

Disguise as a concept

Post by Regnier »

I know 'disguise' was cut and is pretty redundant but the concept still works in the game. It wouldnt be about moving undetected, its moving undisturbed.

This could be implemented not as a skill but as an effect. It could be an advantage that you take, aiding language and stealth style skills, like athleticism aids running etc.

Or maybe as an enchantment that makes MOB groups passive (or w/e). A low cost enchantment so it can go on most things. It would be cool to be able to specify which type of disguise it is. Maybe just divided along the Merchant/Scholar/Commoner reputation lines.

And it could be an Illusion spell that you cast while wearing certain clothes and those clothes determine which mob you are ingratiated with.

This goes well with the new language mod, giving a reason to do this in the first place. Spy missions also come to mind. price and availability differences. crime and punishment differences.

What say ye

daggerdude
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Joined: Sat May 23, 2015 2:22 pm

Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by daggerdude »

I think disguise is one of the things that should have been cut because it simply isn't needed. Don't know how it could really change gameplay in a meaningful way because either your in a dungeon (stealth) and you are using your language skills against monsters, or you're talking to NPC flats who can be buttered up with a few quests.

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BadLuckBurt
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Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by BadLuckBurt »

daggerdude wrote: Thu Jan 06, 2022 11:36 am Don't know how it could really change gameplay in a meaningful way because either your in a dungeon (stealth) and you are using your language skills against monsters, or you're talking to NPC flats who can be buttered up with a few quests.
Disguise as a skill wouldn't really work, probably why they ended up cutting it.

But if someone's prepared to spend some extra time on setting up quests for this, it could definitely work as a quest mechanic.

Normally, if you play as a male, you won't ever see female clothes because of how the game is coded. However, I made a simple quest once to test giving items as quest rewards. You can give any piece of clothing as a reward, DFU doesn't complain and your male character is perfectly capable of equipping that evening gown, it doesn't exactly fit but that's the beauty of it :D All we'd need is bunch of wig and beard sprites that function as helmets to complete the disguise.

You could also make some custom armor items (just codewise) and use those as a disguise. You could even 'reclaim' those pieces at the end of the quest saying the faction will need them for other purposes.

And using some custom quest actions, you can run checks against the disguise and probably even make NPCs react to it.

Just as an example: if the Power Struggle mod by John Doom is extended further, you could do missions for nobles where they send you to eavesdrop on their rivals who might be planning an invasion.

It might not be everyone's cup of tea but it would add more variety to quests.
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daggerdude
Posts: 241
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Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by daggerdude »

Well if you put it that way, perhaps with stealth check in terms of infiltration and personality checks in terms of interactions and yes, being sent to dwynnen with a special surcoat and attire, and perhaps multiple choice information on background and such in dialogues you have to answer correctly on top of skills, some espionage missions could be very fun if done correctly.
one of my favorite other franchises is Hitman. I love infiltrating, stealing items and passcards, changing costume, and inventing ways to achieve my aims.
Come to think of it, this would be nice in terms of assassin missions too in daggerfall.

But, i think whoever it is has a tall order to make it really feel immersive and interesting, otherwise it's just another quest with the same mechanic of "run to the guy" "kill the thing" linear quest logic. I just wonder if Daggerfall is really the game for this is my thought.

Regnier
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2019 6:26 am

Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by Regnier »

i think the easiest implementation would be an illusion spell that disguises you, but, youre right, how would this manifest in daggerfall? Could be based on reputation between the basic factions so wearing an underworld disguise will let you walk freely in a dungeon but the guards will attack on site in a city. Or dressing down to talk to the townsfolk will refuse you entry to palaces and maybe banks or gemstores, but then wearing regal clothes would make the townsfolk think youre a snob but the people in the palace like you a lot more. You could use a 'scent' item for dealing with animals and anything not covered by attire.

I do wonder if daggerfall has enough in game hooks to make this feel significantly different to stealth, though.
Hitman would be a good inspiration.

And even if they end up being similar it could just be thought of like axe, blunt, long/short blade, not much difference but appropriate for roleplaying.

I hope to get people batting this idea around in their heads, maybe running into a scenario that a disguise would be perfect for.

You could impersonate a faction and commit crimes or spark fueds, then walk into town like nothing happened.

It could also be used to not be bothered by certain enemies, but have regular responses from others.
The scent item that you use to keep rats and spiders away, helps you not catch diseases and get paralyzed.

Or you are a low level and you purchase a disguise for higher level enemies. Youll sell it when you get stronger.

Regnier
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2019 6:26 am

Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by Regnier »

i dont know if this can be implemented. can enemies be made to change from one sprite to another? (seducer)

Im thinking a quest can be designed around identifying the correct monster or npc or w/e. So you have to use the info mode to determine which is which but that can only be done by knowing about disguises in some way

You have to go to a residence but instead of killing rats you have to identify the imposter. Is something like this possible?

Regnier
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2019 6:26 am

Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by Regnier »

i wonder if a disguise could be used to potentially get away from guards.

dip into a house, put on the disguise and have a + chance to despawn guards

l3lessed
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Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by l3lessed »

If its added in some form, it should be tied to language and social skills, and it shouldn't use stealth.

Be able to escape hostile guards would be great use. However, instead of despawning them, just have them not hostile, and after a certain period of time, then despawn them. Be odd for all the guards to poof right away, they should still be looking for you for a little.

It could also be used as a boost to language skills. Of course some one will trust you more if you also look like them on top of sounding like them. It rewards players who go through the effort of getting disguises together by making their speech skills way more effective.

Other use could be getting better prices from locals or a chance to get a small price reduction on top of what you base skills already do.
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Utankung
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Nov 22, 2019 1:46 pm

Re: Disguise as a concept

Post by Utankung »

Yeah, there are several situations where a temporary reset of one's reputation would do wonders for a criminal on the rise. I think that is what a disguise would be if I designed it. A shift in reputation with a specific faction (infiltration) or in general (incognito), based on a skill die roll, that provides a percentage chance of getting identified (losing the temporary rep. change).

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