Endless wagon prompts on exit

[BansheeXYZ]

Anyone else think this prompt is a nuisance? 90% of the time I just want to leave, and then I click the wrong button. My brain is conditioned to think prompts are confirmations of actions taken, so clicking door = yes, I'm sure I want to leave. But it's the opposite here because classic didn't or couldn't restore the dungeon the way it was just seconds ago, and it's asking if you want to STAY after you click to LEAVE.

I see two ways of eliminating this goofy prompt:

1. DFU saves map discovery up to 5 dungeons later, so popping outside no longer affects the map. If DFU employed the same logic towards enemy and loots spawns, then the prompt can be eliminated. The player simply goes outside, accesses wagon, and goes back in without changing the dungeon he was just in.

2. If you're not willing to do #1, why not just grant wagon access when you're within range of exiting? The info text could flash "You can access your wagon from here." Boom, no forced clicking and interruptions unless you actually want to access your wagon.

I don't see this as mod territory, I see it as an evolution of changes DFU has already made towards persistence due to the technological limitations of classic.

[jayhova]

I've been thinking about this and it is no longer necessary to limit things based on space concerns. We can have more than yes/no buttons. An exit/wagon set of buttons would be better here. The tutorial is another example. The buttons, rather than yes/no should be exit/continue. Maybe KOW can include some button UI changes in future dreams.

That being said while it might be possible to make it so the PC can access the wagon while within a certain distance of the exit it's just easier to keep things as they are now. if you are just unloading loot it saves some time loading the outside/dungeon just to get to your wagon.

[King of Worms]

I cant change the yes/no buttons here unfortunatelly... because they are used on another places where it would not make any sense afterwards :/

[jayhova]

I suppose that would be a GUI mod that would allow you to substitute different buttons in specific dialog boxes.

[BansheeXYZ]

This isn't primarily about button confusion. It's primarily about being interrupted with a choice every time you leave. There are all kinds of reasons you just want to leave.

You just got done talking to royals in castle daggerfall. Want to stay and access your wagon?

You found the quest item quickly, so you don't encumber yourself. Want to stay and access your wagon?

The dungeon is a small crypt, so you don't get encumbered. Want to stay and access your wagon?

You're too rich to care about most loot, so you never encumber yourself. Want to stay and access your wagon?

Running for your life from a monster? Want to stay and access your wagon?

Want to stay and access your wagon?
Want to stay and access your wagon?
Want to stay and access your wagon?

[Hazelnut]

It's this way to match classic, but I understand what you guys are getting at.

My thoughts are to dump the entire prompt entirely and allow wagon access within 5 meters or so of the exit, but not elsewhere. This would need to be an option though to preserve the ability to play vanilla DF with DFU I think, also the non-message box mechanism would be completely non-obvious to new players and I guess it would gather many bug reports if it were the default.

May give this a go next time I get some time to do DFU work.

[jayhova]

...while it might be possible to make it so the PC can access the wagon while within a certain distance of the exit it's just easier to keep things as they are now. if you are just unloading loot it saves some time loading the outside/dungeon just to get to your wagon.

It's this way to match classic, but I understand what you guys are getting at.

My thoughts are to dump the entire prompt entirely and allow wagon access within 5 meters or so of the exit, but not elsewhere. This would need to be an option though to preserve the ability to play vanilla DF with DFU I think, also the non-message box mechanism would be completely non-obvious to new players and I guess it would gather many bug reports if it were the default.

May give this a go next time I get some time to do DFU work.

It seems a reasonably trivial task to have a checkbox to allow bypassing the wagon message. I would vote to include that as a QOL feature in the next build. That being said, the wagon access in proximity to exit seems less trivial. Perhaps it's something you could do with a raycast to prevent being able to access it from the floor above or below. In any case the bypass should happen right away simply because it's reasonably easy.

[Jay_H]

That gets me thinking of one of those Windows-like prompts:

[ _ ] Hide this message for the rest of this session.

[BansheeXYZ]

It's this way to match classic, but I understand what you guys are getting at.

I get it, I do. You're just trying to remake the game right now, you're not necessarily thinking about everything as you do it. It's not expected of you to notice all of the design problems in that process.

However, I see almost no difference between this and the horse dismount stuff that got changed from classic. Forcing a pause and click here just because the player bought a wagon is bad design.

the non-message box mechanism would be completely non-obvious to new players and I guess it would gather many bug reports if it were the default.

I already talked about that

wagon.png (249.15 KiB) Viewed 2012 times

Longer-term, a configuration window needs to be made so that the player can control what infotext to suppress. Once you saw this text a few times, you could turn it off. I personally would also turn off the tavern room reminders, enemy is dead (duh) text, and you are climbing (duh) text.

[Hazelnut]

I get it, I do. You're just trying to remake the game right now, you're not necessarily thinking about everything as you do it. It's not expected of you to notice all of the design problems in that process.

I cannot speak for the other developers, but I think you underestimate how much I think about everything when I work on features. Hence the horse dismount, arrow counter etc. But yeah the main priority is to get stuff in to remake the classic Daggerfall game as closely as possible,

Hoping to give this a go a the weekend, but I have some stuff to do on the house which apparently is more important according to my other half.