Modern games features port mod ideas

Talk about the mods or features you'd like to see in Daggerfall Unity. Give mod creators some ideas!
GethN7
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Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by GethN7 »

Several things from more modern TES games that would be nice, if only as optional features to replace classic ones for players of later games:

1. Weightless Gold (I know this would make Letters of Credit somewhat less useful, but it would make earning gold less tedious for those who don't like to ping pong between banks)
2. Quest objectives marked on map in dungeons (would make them a LOT less tedious)
3. Swimming controls modernized (WASD should work more or less the same in water instead of requiring use of PG UP/PG DOWN keys to sink or rise
4. Climbing controls modernized (whatever direction you move works instead of the semi-rigid style classic uses)
5. Modernized theft/pickpocketing (Skyrim style mostly)
6. Regenerating health/stamina/magic (Oblivion/Skyrim style)
7. Pawn shops that buy basically everything (including magical items, selling them is quite the hassle)
8. Alchemy overhaul (at bare minimum, like in Morrowind, Daggerfall makes alchemy unbelievably tedious, could have it balanced out by alchemy done by alchemists services always being successful)
9. No material penalties when attacking (would make game easier for Skyrim and later players)
10. More times to train a day
11. Natural progression (as skills improve, so do stats, nice idea for alternative leveling mod)
12. No time-based reputation degradation.

Those are just a few ideas off the top of my head.

l3lessed
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by l3lessed »

Already working on modernizing the combat side, and I'm taking most my inspiration from my heavily modded Skyrim.

I do plan on, after combat is finished, hit enemy and player health/magic/stamina stats and see if I could do a regenerative balanced system like Skyrim. So, if someone doesn't get to it before that, give me time.
My Daggerfall Mods: l3lessed Nexus Page

Daggerfall Unity mods: Combat Overhaul Mod

Enjoy the free work I'm doing? Consider lending your support.

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Hazelnut
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by Hazelnut »

GethN7 wrote: Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:57 pm Several things from more modern TES games that would be nice, if only as optional features to replace classic ones for players of later games:

1. Weightless Gold (I know this would make Letters of Credit somewhat less useful, but it would make earning gold less tedious for those who don't like to ping pong between banks)
Chuck it in your cart. Then it's less ping pong and more occasional popping to the bank.
See my mod code for examples of how to change various aspects of DFU: https://github.com/ajrb/dfunity-mods

GethN7
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by GethN7 »

Another fun feature would be edible alchemy ingredients. They'd be far less effective than a potion, and some would have bad effects, but it would give them more uses than they have at present.

This would probably need to be included as a feature that overhauls the whole alchemy system, though.

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King of Worms
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by King of Worms »

Half of it sounds like the dumbing down to me, thing I hated since tes 2 on...

GethN7
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by GethN7 »

King of Worms wrote: Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:08 am Half of it sounds like the dumbing down to me, thing I hated since tes 2 on...
It does, but it's mostly for players of the later games repulsed by Daggerfall's harder aspects.

Personally,I got used it and even enjoy the challenge for the most part (though I admit it would make many aspects way less tedious for me too), but it's a moddable game, so making it accessible for new and old players used to the easier games in the series as an option is not a bad thing per se.

Ommamar
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by Ommamar »

GethN7 wrote: Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:57 pm Several things from more modern TES games that would be nice, if only as optional features to replace classic ones for players of later games:

1. Weightless Gold (I know this would make Letters of Credit somewhat less useful, but it would make earning gold less tedious for those who don't like to ping pong between banks)
2. Quest objectives marked on map in dungeons (would make them a LOT less tedious)
3. Swimming controls modernized (WASD should work more or less the same in water instead of requiring use of PG UP/PG DOWN keys to sink or rise
4. Climbing controls modernized (whatever direction you move works instead of the semi-rigid style classic uses)
5. Modernized theft/pickpocketing (Skyrim style mostly)
6. Regenerating health/stamina/magic (Oblivion/Skyrim style)
7. Pawn shops that buy basically everything (including magical items, selling them is quite the hassle)
8. Alchemy overhaul (at bare minimum, like in Morrowind, Daggerfall makes alchemy unbelievably tedious, could have it balanced out by alchemy done by alchemists services always being successful)
9. No material penalties when attacking (would make game easier for Skyrim and later players)
10. More times to train a day
11. Natural progression (as skills improve, so do stats, nice idea for alternative leveling mod)
12. No time-based reputation degradation.

Those are just a few ideas off the top of my head.
Last edited by Ommamar on Sat Apr 18, 2020 1:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

GethN7
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by GethN7 »

Ommamar wrote: Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:02 pm
GethN7 wrote: Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:57 pm Several things from more modern TES games that would be nice, if only as optional features to replace classic ones for players of later games:

1. Weightless Gold (I know this would make Letters of Credit somewhat less useful, but it would make earning gold less tedious for those who don't like to ping pong between banks)
2. Quest objectives marked on map in dungeons (would make them a LOT less tedious)
3. Swimming controls modernized (WASD should work more or less the same in water instead of requiring use of PG UP/PG DOWN keys to sink or rise
4. Climbing controls modernized (whatever direction you move works instead of the semi-rigid style classic uses)
5. Modernized theft/pickpocketing (Skyrim style mostly)
6. Regenerating health/stamina/magic (Oblivion/Skyrim style)
7. Pawn shops that buy basically everything (including magical items, selling them is quite the hassle)
8. Alchemy overhaul (at bare minimum, like in Morrowind, Daggerfall makes alchemy unbelievably tedious, could have it balanced out by alchemy done by alchemists services always being successful)
9. No material penalties when attacking (would make game easier for Skyrim and later players)
10. More times to train a day
11. Natural progression (as skills improve, so do stats, nice idea for alternative leveling mod)
12. No time-based reputation degradation.

Those are just a few ideas off the top of my head.
1. I like that gold has weight as it really should. There are features to get around it, letters of credit that you mentioned, use of your wagon that has also been mentioned, once you invest in a house or a ship you can drop gold there as well. I wouldn't mind the implementation of designated containers to do this as the item icon in Daggerfall have never matched up well with what you drop/find on the ground.

2. This is semi implemented in an existing mod but you do have to explore some and the marker can get confusing in complicated dungeons. If it is in I would like to see it as an extension of the sense item spell already existing, basically want some cost or action performed by the player to locate where things are.

3. I would make it work similar to levitate (a nice addition to a water breathing/water walking custom spell) where you can go up and down by adjusting your mouse view.

4. Climbing as been greatly improved in DFU the only issue I have had is sometimes getting stuck entering hanging mode where I have to port out with the console. Generally I can grab walls, transition corners and move horizontally while climbing vertically.

5. A thief type character is probably the least played type in all the TES games so not sure what you mean. I think both the pickpocket and lock picking system could be expanded on.

6. Since there are options you can take in character creation and spells you can cast already in the game I would leave it as is.

7. The selling of magical items is being worked on and should be working close to they way the current developers want it in the next build. I don't think it will just be tied into pawn shops, I like that you can't sell everything in one place, that it behooves you to visit different shops. You can make an additional aspect of the game by finding the shops that buy the highest and sell the lowest.

8. I have some ideas for the alchemy system to expand it, that comes down to time and my knowledge base before I can really start implementing those ideas.

9. The material requirements is one of the unique aspects of Daggerfall, this is one of the many things I would of liked carried over into the later games not a reduction placed on Daggerfall to pander to what I refer to as the console mindset.

10. I would keep the current system but expand it to include things like training dummies that give a smaller percentage of a skill increase then fighting an actual enemy. This would include areas to practice spells that would only raise you skill in that area, these could be included as an additional cost of renting a tavern room. You could still be a "Tavern" caster but it wouldn't be casting in your room but in the casting room you would have to pay additional gold for. The mages guild and a few temples would have their own room you could practice in if you where affiliated with them. It could also be an expansion of the housing as you could purchase a room dedicated to practicing spells or one with a training dummy in it.

11. On the fence with this one the current system makes you think strategically of how you place point in attributes. I am a huge sucker though for a logical system that raises your attributes based on what you do. So if you swing heavy chunks of metal around your strength would go up, if your run. jump. climb then bother your endurance and agility should go up.

12. The reputation needs adjusting, not sure of the idea to get rid of the degradation completely, it could be expanded. One nice thing would be a pop up that shows you how the general categories as well as how your reputation with the quest giver would be adjusted. I have seen post pointing to the system being very complex so not sure how easy it would be to change it.
Can't really disagree with most of these, they all make sense. However, I wouldn't be opposed to providing tweaks to provide consistency with later games.

1. Silver and higher generally applied to Morrowind and later, unless the item was enchanted. That would be a simpler alternative to how Daggerfall does things that would still retain the challenge, given the rarity of certain items above elven, especially early on.

2. Thieves are underplayed, but Daggerfall ironically provided most features like climbing, backstabbing, and other thief friendly skills to make good use of thief type characters, wouldn't hurt to build off that.

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Hazelnut
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by Hazelnut »

Ommamar wrote: Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:02 pm
1. I like that gold has weight as it really should. There are features to get around it, letters of credit that you mentioned, use of your wagon that has also been mentioned, once you invest in a house or a ship you can drop gold there as well. I wouldn't mind the implementation of designated containers to do this as the item icon in Daggerfall have never matched up well with what you drop/find on the ground.
FYI, you can change the icons for player created loot piles... see viewtopic.php?f=12&t=849

Try left and right clicking on the icon on the top right of inventory screen. Middle button selects different icon archives. :D

We really need to get this stuff documented on a player guide on the wiki.
See my mod code for examples of how to change various aspects of DFU: https://github.com/ajrb/dfunity-mods

Firebrand
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Re: Modern games features port mod ideas

Post by Firebrand »

I would personally prefer to deepen certain aspects of Daggerfall which where not well explored at the time of release, while avoiding simplifications which could change the real soul of the game.

So for example, I think that these would be great:
GethN7 wrote: Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:57 pm 5. Modernized theft/pickpocketing (Skyrim style mostly)
8. Alchemy overhaul (at bare minimum, like in Morrowind, Daggerfall makes alchemy unbelievably tedious, could have it balanced out by alchemy done by alchemists services always being successful)
10. More times to train a day
11. Natural progression (as skills improve, so do stats, nice idea for alternative leveling mod)
While I've already written in other posts that lockpicking or alchemy would certainly greatly benefits from more modern logics, I've to say that after a few weeks playing Daggerfall, I feel that Training is very underpowered, compared to, say, Oblivion or Skyrim. For example, let's continue to say that each training session could last 3 hours: why I cannot have in a day other 2 sessions? What kind of school let's you study or practice for up to just 3 hours a day? It's a joke :lol: :lol: :lol:
It would be great to have up to 3 sessions per day, while keeping the current stamina and time consumption for each of them. After a session of study, you could rest, have a lunch at the tavern, and then continue to train :)

About Natural Progression: I play Oblivion only with Realistic Leveling mod
https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods ... escription
and I'd love to see something like it also in Daggerfall. You're using your mace a lot and you're Blunt skill increase? Good, then also your Strenght (and maybe Agility) increase! You're casting a lot of Illusion spells, and your Illusion skill increase? Good, then also your Intelligence (and maybe Willpower) increase! You're running a lot, and so your Running skill increase? Good, so also your Speed (and maybe Endurance) increase!
It doesn't really make much more sense to me the standard Daggerfall leveling system: you increase your core skills, and got a lot of stats point to distribute. How on earth, for example, increasing my jumping skill improve my Personality? :lol: :lol: :lol:


On the other hand, I'll avoid things like this:
GethN7 wrote: Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:57 pm 1. Weightless Gold (I know this would make Letters of Credit somewhat less useful, but it would make earning gold less tedious for those who don't like to ping pong between banks)
2. Quest objectives marked on map in dungeons (would make them a LOT less tedious)
9. No material penalties when attacking (would make game easier for Skyrim and later players)
For example, why I'm supposed to know the location of a quest objective in a dungeon? :?
Also, I appreciate that gold has weight and that to kill certain enemies you need at least certain materials, because they make you think before acting. Also, the possibility added in DFU to move the gold in the cart is great because it makes sense and doesn't destroy the core mechanic, but just make it more sensible and practical.

For othersì features, it depends on tastes; for example, I'd love to see these:
GethN7 wrote: Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:57 pm 6. Regenerating health/stamina/magic (Oblivion/Skyrim style)
12. No time-based reputation degradation.
I've to say, a regenerating Magicka Regen mod already exists and I love it, because it makes the game more Oblivion style 8-)
Here's the link for anyone who wants to try it out:

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1653&hilit=regen

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