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Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:43 pm
by Midknightprince
Great, MORE textures to go thru :lol:
I have been waiting for that jungle ruin texture.
I know where to find it but I don't know the # to change it.
You are seriously kicking butt KingofWorms

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 7:25 pm
by King of Worms
:) Thanks man, btw its not jungle ruin but jungle city walls, I have not made any ruins yet. Im getting bit of tired now, I invested unreal amounts of time in this all, flats and textures... Im not sure when/if I will release it, I dont like my half finished stuff being judged. And just preparing it for release is unnecessary work on its own, when its something like v0.1 ... so final bottom line is, it will be released when I want and nobody knows when that will happen.

I dont want to release my buildings, when emission maps are not working for them now, and than the lights dont turn on at night. Will be the same as with NPC, they fuck everyones PC because of things I cant do squat about, I dont even have specs to work with yet, than rest of the flats I did are rendered in 1/4 resolution and ppl are like "this shit is blurry"... and I should explain why etc. No. When its done than its done, I realized I dont enjoy releasing it like this. Than ppl will tell me lights dont work etc etc etc, it will be judged like a final product and I can write its not all day all night and it wont change jack and I dont want that. Somewhere in 2018 maybe, maybe not.

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:37 pm
by King of Worms
Upscaling the freaking buildings so... castle, palace, city, village, farm, mages guild, manor, merchant, tavern, temple
Its so tedious and boring, it hurts the brain as well, because its like a 20 step process for every 4-5 textures, and there are 550 textures. Im quite sure nobody can imagine...

Open source folder
Copy to "0 original" folder
Open Resizer
Load the script (click load scrip, navigate to the script, double click it)
Execute the script
Delete the content of "0 original" folder
Click to "0 resized" folder
Select all textures
Move them to the "textures" area in a folder with number
Change that number to the number of the set you doing
Click the next script so the textures are renamed the correct way
GREAT! Now, you have 4-5 textures from one set ALMOST ready. Repeat with the next 16 folders from this set. Than copy all textures you created into another folder, where you have categorized your textures, place is in the -COMPILED- subfolder in a corresponding section. GREAT! Now, you have 50 textures ready! Continue till your skull cracks...

And this is heavily optimized process.. took a while to get all the scripts ready and to minimize the amount of steps, thanks to The Lacus for helping me with the scripts part! Creating the source folder logic is hard and took a while as well... same with the final textures folder. You GOT to keep those folders clean, logical, perfect... or you will LOOSE the fight with those 2x 10000 files. They will KILL YOU!! Theres more to it in all points described. Its crazy. And it literally hurts to do it.

But I will do it... For the sake of Daggerfall :lol:

Now come tell me the resized textures are blurry and that you cant tell a difference... and I will show you why Im called King of Worms!!!!

ingame, you can go very close to the upscaled texture and it will not become blurry. Vanila texture will be more blurry even from a distance of lets say 10-20 meters. From bigger distance, upscaled and vanila look the same. But they look good, because they are small... I tested it extensively. This takes the GFX to another level but keeps it 100% vanilla. For me, its a big step forward. And thats what matters, as Im not really selling this to anyone...
compare.png (635.28 KiB) Viewed 2091 times

PS: I stopped for 2 days doing textures, and I still have dreams of it anyway... today I did just 2-3 hours of DFU work Id say... need a bigger rest... so this fast pace is at the end...

I guess I was in it since atleast DECEMBER 1st 2017, since than, this was basically my fulltime job, and I went full in, worked really intensively for at least 6 weeks :twisted: I dont really know what to say... Way too much time, more than Im willing to admint to anyone :) Im affraid it attacks 400 hours... But I had that free time, and I decided to invest it here. Now its time for engine to catch up :P And for me to rest... I will finalize few things... than I upload it to some cloud, and relax...

With all the flats (even if they dont work ingame yet) - we talking 1000s of textures. Id say 6000+.... I know every god damned texture in this freaking game :D And every flat. This texture archive is embedded in me now. LOL. :ugeek: :geek: :ugeek:

When I come back, I hope the NPCs will work, I want to upscale town folks, necromancers, temple ppl, everybody... they deserve it, but its not possible yet.

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:36 pm
by Jay_H
Sounds like me :) I've taken a break from writing quests because it really is work. I think we've had the same feeling at different times :) But you and I have a lot to show for now. Take your break, do what you feel like, and if you come back it'll be good to see more :)

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:07 pm
by ifkopifko
Which one is the original texture, because I can't see any difference... :D Sorry, I just had to... Looks very nice, and I really can't wait to play the enhanced edition of Daggerfall. :D (But I will wait, no worries.)

But you know my opinion already... I would halve the resolution because the difference seems miniscule (judging from the png, did not see it ingame). Can you actually tell the difference between 1024x2048 and 512x1024 when bilinear filtering is enabled?

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:31 pm
by King of Worms
Thanks Jay, yes I need to step down a bit now, eventho I have some urges to continue... its like a addiction .) But the 3 nights of texturing dreams were a clear sign of being overworked. I think I will just conclude/enclose this part somehow, clean it and wrap it up, so Its easy to resume anytime later on, which might be not so far in the future. Some parts really were like a work, but its working on something I like, so I did it, Im sure you know what I mean ;)

Pifko, dont play with fire :P With the textures, the resolution doesnt matter too much, its very different case than with the flats. Flats are supersensitive to resolution, textures are more about size, and mine are small.

Yes, I can absolutely see a difference. Im not a maniac or a stupid person, these textures are 1k x 2k for a reason, not because I like big numbers - that reason is they look the best like this. And game has no problem. So nothing to solve or think about here. Absolutely no reason to make em 1/2 res. I think you mistake this with the flats...

Flats are different case, but I already spoke in a big detail about it with you. Im not gonna downscale em back to stone age, because if I did it, the whole upscaling idea would be abandoned... no. There are other ways around, but Im not the one who can open them! People who can do that, know about this - Ive made sure... and its up to them, if they forget it, or try to do it.

I have hopes in them... because when I see what was achieved so far, I know this detail I need will be achieved as well. We talk freaking 1gb of data in case of flats. Possibly not even that... dont tell me Unity and 2018 computers cant handle that, thats nonsense. Fuck downscaling my work. Thats REALLY not a way to solve this case.

EDIT: theres something wrong with memory management. I can crash my 8gb RAM 4 GB VRAM PC with vanila DFU if I turn the paging file off... thats clear sign. I can do so in max 5 minutes, possibly with two loads! Also, If I enable lets say 16gb paging file, this game will eat that 16 plus my 8 plus 3gb of VRAM, thats freaking 27gb of memory, in vanilla state. This tells me there is a possibility of optimalization.. ehm... lets say.. cough..

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:48 pm
by ifkopifko
Ok ok, I understand man, don't burn me right away. :D I am as silent as a grave about downscaling. One thing thoug, it may well be you are right and resolution does not matter if the file is small. But that is at engine level, I would not be so sure about graphics card driver level... but it might not be a problem for contemporary graphics cards.

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:12 pm
by TheLacus
King of Worms wrote: Pifko, dont play with fire :P With the textures, the resolution doesnt matter too much, its very different case than with the flats. Flats are supersensitive to resolution, textures are more about size, and mine are small.
Size may have effect on loading times, especially if the game is on an hard disk i guess, but texture resolution sure have an important effect on performance. If you look on nexus, they always provide different packs with downsized texture so one can pick what the hardware allows. But if you have a lot of files i can see it becoming demanding to manage, so just do what you want to dedicate time to ;)

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:04 pm
by King of Worms
Yes, size of textures in Kb affects loading times and memory requirements, esp VRAM
Size in term of resolution usually affects the size in Kb... so thus ppl downscale the textures on nexus, like in case of fallout 4, which had way too high res oon normal maps etc. Its was a reduction of resolution (and other compression methods used) to get a reduction in size (kb) so the VRAM and RAM is not so oversaturated

With the textures I do its a different story. They come from a originals which are what? 256 colours? Because of this, and the method used (not many color gradients) those resized textures are very small in Kb... because there is little DATA inside it.

See... my 1024*2048 upscaled texture of a building part is cca 300kb..
Than you take the new fresh textures which are 512*1024 and they are easily 1mb...

but in both cases, we are in the 1999 levels of size :)

Pifko, yes, it might be more about the Graphics card level than engine level. But we talk miniscule resolutions and sizes here anyway. We talk kb and 1k to 2k... thats NOTHING. Again, we are in 2018, not 1998 :) My whole pack so far has 1gb... yet it can saturate 24gb ram pc. Also the FACT this game crashes when you run vanila and no paging file... there is something off there, I suspect its the cache settings. Also, the way it handles animated NPCs etc, I dont want to repeat myself to death ;)

300kb 1k * 2k texture
basically no color gradients, and 256 colours, maybe 16 .)
063_1-0.png (315.5 KiB) Viewed 1990 times
1mb 512*1024 texture
080_2-0.png (1.04 MiB) Viewed 1990 times
I can get you example of 5mb 512 texture in png... etc. Bottom line is the size in kb. Not a resolution. I can get you a 5k * 5k 5kb texture of black color. I doubt your GFX card will have a hard time rendering it :)

Anyway, Im too tired, sorry if I dont make sense. But I doubt these 300kb textures are of any concern. My pc can handle em perfectly and so will be yours. Only problem is with those god damned FLATS/SPRITES, and its because engine handles them differently than textures. If we can make the flats being handled the way textures are handled now, problem is solved (plus remove the super-atlas, and re-check how animated NPCs are cached, basicaly check the whole cache and its behavior)

They destroy any PC, and they will do so, until I downscale em back to 320 * 200. Something needs to change there, if we want flat/sprite mods. And we want them .)

Re: Daggerfall retexture

Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:58 am
by ifkopifko
Just one last note to explain what I wanted to say: I have to stress again, that I have no real knowledge on how unity works with textures, however, the fact it can load a texture in .png format does not mean the engine continues to work with the texture in that format. It most likely has to convert it to something else (with different type of compression, if any). The same applies to graphics card driver level.

I just hope you will not be put off by my stupid comments. I really mean it in a good way, even if it does not seem so. Written messages can be deceitful. :)