Cracking Open Combat

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Rytelier
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by Rytelier » Wed Aug 28, 2019 5:27 pm

I'm interested in this project and what it may bring into future.

What is the stance on full 3D models for player and enemies?
For good combat, the poor Daggerfall's sprites don't allow much. There's poor animation and it doesn't give proper feedback. Even the weapon swing - it's so linear, just weapon goes moved, no weight, no force.

Also I would be interested in upgrading AI for enemies to do more than just moving forward and attacking. Take look at Dark Souls game, where enemies have their unique behavior. This also would require 3D models, because sprites are very limited in what enemies can do.

Take a look at inspiration: https://youtu.be/JseiwRQBQGU

l3lessed
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by l3lessed » Thu Aug 29, 2019 12:51 am

Oh man, I would love to implement that, but engines do not work that easily.

I am talking with someone now, who is looking into adding 3d models for enemies, starting with static ones and then possibly seeing what he can do with animations. Will see where and how far he gets.

As for a first person model rig like that, Again I would love to. However, it isn't as simple as just inserting the model and animations. I will need to code in a whole new animation system to run 3d models and animations through unity. On a theoretical basis, it should take removing all current 2d weapon sprites, removing the whole FPSWeapon script and creating a new first person animation control script file. Completely reworking the Weaponmanager script so it connects with and communicates efficiently and bug free with a whole new first person weapon management script to initiate proper animations and ensure raycasts follow its animation and time path. Or, if possible, remove raycast hits completely and try a newer system, but I can tell you, collision boxes tend to have issues with hi speed melee animations in most engine. Not sure about unity exactly.

https://answers.unrealengine.com/questi ... /view.html

That doesn't include making and rigging all the animations themselves.

This is a goal of mine, but it isn't possible until someone can create and provide a good model and animation set for every weapon and attack direction. Then, I can begin recoding the whole animation system to support 3d models properly.
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l3lessed
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by l3lessed » Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:59 am

I am curious and sure this would be a future expansion but how hard do you think it would be put these combat effects into enemy weapon casts? It is great to see my swings having a more realistic reaction to the environment, it would be even more dynamic to see the NPC enemies having to deal with the same factors.
I haven't really looked into how the enemy side is handled yet. I planned on moving there after I got all my base features/coding in. I would like enemies to have to deal with something similar. The one issue though is how simple the enemy AI is. Again, haven't checked into the coding, but if they can't figure out how to properly move around u shaped tables and objects, not sure how easy it would be to code in some type of environmental awareness code.

I'll cross those rivers when I get there.
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Ommamar
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by Ommamar » Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:36 am

l3lessed wrote:
Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:59 am
I am curious and sure this would be a future expansion but how hard do you think it would be put these combat effects into enemy weapon casts? It is great to see my swings having a more realistic reaction to the environment, it would be even more dynamic to see the NPC enemies having to deal with the same factors.
I haven't really looked into how the enemy side is handled yet. I planned on moving there after I got all my base features/coding in. I would like enemies to have to deal with something similar. The one issue though is how simple the enemy AI is. Again, haven't checked into the coding, but if they can't figure out how to properly move around u shaped tables and objects, not sure how easy it would be to code in some type of environmental awareness code.

I'll cross those rivers when I get there.
Well I noticed that in DFU they are more likely to climb over a table or obstacle where in classic they would get stuck behind them. A good example is the archer in the room with the U shaped table in Privateer's Hold, in classic it was fairly easy to fight him while he was behind the table. In DFU he just climbs over and comes within melee range most of the time.

I understand it would be something to look at once you have the players combat worked out. Nice to hear you have considered it and are motivated to make something similar to what the players will use.

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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by l3lessed » Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:11 am

Interesting, I haven't noticed this behavior in my build. I am not running the newest update though. I am one version behind.
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by l3lessed » Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:28 am

Well, randomly got this added in. I like it better than the static idle animation.

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Ommamar
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by Ommamar » Tue Sep 03, 2019 10:50 pm

I like that helps remove the your on rails feel! I role play this but one option I would like to see implemented is climbing being disabled unless your weapon is sheathed. I would think a simple Boolean flag with a pop up message saying your weapon gets in the way maybe if you free up your hands would be a good implementation. Not directly combat related just an observation of a small change that makes logical sense.

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King of Worms
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by King of Worms » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:38 pm

Thats really nice, Ive send you the 1st person weapons source files in a PM a while ago, I hope you noticed that PM .)

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Ralzar
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by Ralzar » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:45 pm

Ommamar wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 10:50 pm
I like that helps remove the your on rails feel! I role play this but one option I would like to see implemented is climbing being disabled unless your weapon is sheathed. I would think a simple Boolean flag with a pop up message saying your weapon gets in the way maybe if you free up your hands would be a good implementation. Not directly combat related just an observation of a small change that makes logical sense.
You should suggest it over in Hazelnuts Roleplay&Realism mod thread. That seems like the kind of light-touch mechanic changes that fits his mod :)

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mikeprichard
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Re: Cracking Open Combat

Post by mikeprichard » Sun Dec 08, 2019 3:48 pm

mikeprichard wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:28 pm
On a point Ommamar just raised re: Stealth mechanics, since it's likely something you'd eventually be interested in for your own purposes, and you also seem to know your way around the code, I'm hoping I can leverage your knowledge. I'm trying to update the UESP wiki pages for classic Daggerfall (see viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2514) to correct vague/inaccurate information. I understand from Interkarma that DFU replicates exactly classic's Stealth behavior, but the point I'm trying to 100% confirm here from the DFU code is the following (paraphrased from the other topic). Would you have any insight into this? I'd greatly appreciate any comments/direction you could share:

While trying to determine how Stealth mechanics (i.e. detection of player by enemies related to the player's Stealth skill) work in classic/DFU, I found this DFU code (https://github.com/Interkarma/daggerfal ... es.cs#L573). I have no idea how to correctly read this, but what I'm trying to clearly determine is whether the Stealth skill is completely "deactivated" when the player is running - i.e. whether it's only active when walking, sneaking, and/or crouching (all of which slow the player as noted by Interkarma, and which I'm guessing "playerMotor.IsMovingLessThanHalfSpeed" is referring to, though I'm not sure how that line actually translates to running vs. walking vs. sneaking vs. crouching in-game(?)). If Stealth is in fact not operative when the player is running, I'll need to tweak the UESP page again for classic/DFU.
l3lessed wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:44 pm
I'll look into it when I have a chance in next week or so. I need to track down where the stealth mechanics are located, as I have not seen any indication of them in the combat scripting I have been running through.
l3lessed - I'm revisiting information that still needs to be confirmed/updated on the classic UESP wiki, and would appreciate knowing if you've been able to track down the above info regarding stealth mechanics over the past few months (please see in particular my original underlined question above). Thanks!

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