Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

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pango
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Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by pango » Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:11 pm

In classic Daggerfall, dungeon "entrance" often cover a normal door, at least for "cemetary" dungeons. If a monster that can open doors spawns on the other side of the entrance, you may see a door opening off the entrance; This looks weird, but that's the extent of the bug because even if the door is open, monsters cannot cross the entrance, that behaves as a wall.
It is not so in Daggerfall Unity: monsters can cross the entrance and attack your from behind when you just entered a cemetary dungeon.
(and yes I checked that the entrance works as a wall for the player, so you cannot explore the room hidden behind the entrance when it happens. Or maybe the entrance can only be crossed in one direction).
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pango
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by pango » Sat Sep 29, 2018 5:49 am

PS: ok, after some trickeries with teleportation debug command in DFU and walk into the Void in classic, the issue is really that the entrance can be crossed when you arrive from "behind" it in DFU

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Interkarma
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by Interkarma » Sat Sep 29, 2018 6:11 am

Thanks for report. Yeah, it's just a one-sided polygon so is neither visible or collidable from opposite side.

I can change this to a box collider that will prevent monster from being able to cross out of hidden room like classic. It's a simple fix that I've used elsewhere.

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pango
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by pango » Sat Sep 29, 2018 7:11 am

Hi Interkarma,
Can you also prevent the underlying door from opening?
That would be an improvement vs classic, and is probably harder to fix, but it looks so meh...
When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
-- Charles Goodhart

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Interkarma
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by Interkarma » Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:02 am

Yeah, I think that might be doable. I've been mulling this problem over for a few years now, so have a few things to try already. No promises though.

But I can definitely fix the issue of monster charging through the exit quad from behind. :)

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Prester Lewin
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by Prester Lewin » Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:14 pm

I quite like that enemy appearing! There's the potential for more loot and it keeps you on your toes. :lol:

But it would be better tidied up, I suppose...
Last edited by Prester Lewin on Wed Nov 21, 2018 2:11 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Prester Lewin
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by Prester Lewin » Wed Nov 21, 2018 2:09 am

I've come across a dungeon where the exit inside the dungeon is at one of the crossovers between 2 blocks. Getting round to the back of the exit, I am able to see and pass through it - in one direction only, from the back of the exit to the front. I'll try it in classic when I have time. (Build #139, win 10 64 bit)
SAVE1404.7z
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This is the view from behind the exit, looking back to treasure piles I left on the floor in front of the exit:
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pango
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by pango » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:03 am

Interesting, so the "entrances" should not only bar the way from the rear, but have some texture on their back too...
When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
-- Charles Goodhart

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Prester Lewin
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by Prester Lewin » Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:28 pm

It turns out that Bethesda had a cunning plan for this one, and it seems to work. In classic, the exit is on one side of the seal between the two blocks, so you can step instantly between blocks or click on the exit at will. DFU has the polygon fixed across the mid-point of the seal.

I don't know if Bethesda's trick would be considered as a possible solution to graveyards. It wouldn't help with doors possibly getting in the way of the exit.

In any case, this is a minor dungeon design issue for DFU to deal with.

Classic game save for reference:
SAVE4.7z
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Re: Linux #132: "entrance" is not a barrier for monsters

Post by pango » Mon May 06, 2019 1:28 pm

Mmmh I thought it was partially fixed (monsters could still open the "door" from behind but not cross it anymore), but I just got attacked twice...
Either I've been lucky for a while, or there has been some regression...
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When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
-- Charles Goodhart

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