[0.10.27] Bow sometimes hit an "Invisible Wall" in Dungeon

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pango
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[0.10.27] Bow sometimes hit an "Invisible Wall" in Dungeon

Post by pango »

In my experience they're two main cases when arrows can be "lost":
  • when you or your target are close to a static obstacle, say a wall or a door frame, then it can hit the wall instead of your opponent, and since there no visual or audible clue that this is happening, you don't always know why you missed your target. Maybe some audio clue would help here;
  • the arrow disappears in mid air, and again from my experience it happens near slopes; Either in slanted corridors, or slanted floors.
Investigating that issue a bit, I came across AABB (axis aligned bounding box) algorithm description and how it can trigger ghost collisions. I made the observation that slanted walls were usually involved beforehand, but it really fits.
I tested this by disabling mesh collider and reenabling sphere collider on arrow prefab and drastically lowering the sphere collider radius override in the code (ColliderRadius = 0.02f... by the way isn't it unusual to override the radius by code instead of using prefab value?), and I no longer see arrows disappearing in mid air (it's still difficult to shoot thru doors though, even if it feels a bit easier).
I suspect totally switching to so raycast solution would be at least as good and have better performance, but I'm not sure how to do that, does it require to replace the whole the rigidbody colliding mechanism...

Talking of "missiles", there's another weirdness, noticed among others by streamers like FearfulPinata, that exploding spell have a collider. That's most noticeable when you rush toward a caster that just sent a spell at you, for a brief moment "something" gets in your way. I didn't report it immediately because it could kind of make sense, but I agree that it feels a bit strange when it happens.

Game save: can't shoot the lamia from that location
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Interkarma
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Re: [0.10.27] Bow sometimes hit an "Invisible Wall" in Dungeon

Post by Interkarma »

Relevant bug report info moved here from below topic.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2646

Regnier
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Daggerfall Unity 0.10.28

Post by Regnier »

Interkarma wrote: Wed Dec 16, 2020 12:56 pm I'll post an article soon (within next 24 hours). There are only a few minor changes over 0.10.28, which was the "pre-beta" release to make sure no showstopping bugs. But yeah, first official beta release. :D
What has come of that archery hit detection investigation? lol. I still have a hell of a time hitting things quite a bit.

95 agility and about 70 in archery, mithril bow btw

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Interkarma
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Re: [0.10.27] Bow sometimes hit an "Invisible Wall" in Dungeon

Post by Interkarma »

Regnier wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:41 am
Interkarma wrote: Wed Dec 16, 2020 12:56 pm I'll post an article soon (within next 24 hours). There are only a few minor changes over 0.10.28, which was the "pre-beta" release to make sure no showstopping bugs. But yeah, first official beta release. :D
What has come of that archery hit detection investigation? lol. I still have a hell of a time hitting things quite a bit.

95 agility and about 70 in archery, mithril bow btw
There's an open bug report for this issue, it will be reviewed in future. :) Please follow that topic for updates. I'll merge your post over there for followup later.

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Nystul
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Re: [0.10.27] Bow sometimes hit an "Invisible Wall" in Dungeon

Post by Nystul »

One thing that we should check if it is caused by collison with geometry of the automap. This geometry should be in its own layer (layer Automap) but maybe there is a raycast with wrong layer settings for arrow shots

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Ralzar
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[0.11.4] Archery hits invisible wall

Post by Ralzar »

I am currently playing an archer character. He has 93% archery and uses an ebony bow. So his tohit rolls should be fairly good.
However I have been noticing that sometimes, particularly in dungeons, it is like the game decides that I should no longer be allowed to hit. I have had many fights where I have been desperately trying to find the magic spot to aim on an enemy to connect with the hitbox. Sometimes I might be fighting many identical enemies where I consistently hit them and then suddenly it is just whiff, whiff, whiff etc.

Now I finally wound up in a situation that made it very obvious. I am doing one of Jays Quest Pack 1 fighters guild quests where a string of monsters spawn in a residence. They all spawn on the quest marker which in this case is in a small room. I am standing outside the room and seem to only hit them when they exit the room. The the third enemy is a slaughterfish (which I assume jay added just for funsies). The slaughterfish apparently can not move above water, so it just stays in the small room where it is impossible to hit it with my bow unless I walk up to the treshold of the room, where I suddenly 1-shot it.

sfish.png
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I have stripped out all mods and modded items and made a save where I did the same test. Result seems to still be the same.

Unmodded save:
SAVE12.zip
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Ralzar
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Re: [0.11.4] Archery hits invisible wall

Post by Ralzar »

Small update:

I was able to kill the slaughterfish through the door by aiming this exact spot:
sfish2.png
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Edit: After the fish, a scorpion spawns. I manage to shoot that as well by shooting at the door from an angle.
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Ralzar
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Re: [0.10.27] Bow sometimes hit an "Invisible Wall" in Dungeon

Post by Ralzar »

Small addition: I just figures out that in cases where you seem to have a clear line of fire but the arrows are not connecting, an easy way to check if you can actually hit is to use Info Mode (as long as the target is close enough).
If you click on the enemy and nothing happens, you are not hitting the enemy. As soon as you find a spot to click where you get the usual "You see a <enemy name>", you can shoot at that spot and hit the enemy.

Here I am clicking on the knight, and there is no response. Any arrows fired like this also just disappear.
info1.png
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I move the aim down to knee/hip area and suddenly I get the info text. Here I can also hit him with arrows.
info2.png
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Interkarma
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Re: [0.10.27] Bow sometimes hit an "Invisible Wall" in Dungeon

Post by Interkarma »

Ralzar's issue looks to be the standard problem of "threading the needle" - which is to say firing an invisible sphere through doorways and around other obstacles without sphere clipping geometry. Info mode isn't fully comparable as it uses a raycast.

The initial report sounds like something different - e.g. an arrow hitting map geometry due to layer masking as Nystul suggests, or some other unusual physics interaction as posited by Pango.

I'll still work through everything here when this topic gets looked at in final stages of beta this year.

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