Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Discuss Daggerfall Unity and Daggerfall Tools for Unity.
Teralitha
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Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by Teralitha » Thu Jul 18, 2019 2:50 am

Since you are only allowed to make a single lockpick/pilfer attempt anyway, can you make it so that pilfering mode switches back to grab mode automatically after that one attempt? This would save alot of us from accidentally attempting to pickpocket or pick locks in the wrong place and the wrong time when we forget to switch it back.


AND can you make it so your weapon is automatically sheathed when entering a town from the quick travel map?


These changes would bring Daggerfall Unity one step closer to perfection.

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jayhova
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by jayhova » Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:33 pm

This changes a fundamental way the game is played. See QOL in the glossary.
Remember always 'What would Julian Do?'.
Windows 10 Pro 64 bit. DFU Ver. Alpha 0.10.7

Teralitha
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by Teralitha » Sat Jul 20, 2019 4:02 pm

Pressing a button to switch between grab and pilfer(to not having to press the button) is a fundamental change? You prefer getting jailed and losing rep just because you forgot to change it after leaving a dungeon? This is indeed a QOL change. I think you just wanted to get me to look at your glossary ;P

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Interkarma
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by Interkarma » Sat Jul 20, 2019 10:01 pm

I'm a bit wary about changing interaction modes on the player without their input. I find this kind of thing breaks my mental map of game state. I'd prefer the agency of making these changes myself and the consequences of failing to make that change where needed.

If DF was an original creation of my own, I'd personally do away with interaction modes altogether. I floated this idea during early development and feedback was majority in support for keeping them like classic.

I don't see the harm in making this an optional QoL change or enable it to be delivered via a mod. I'm interested in hearing feedback from others though. I don't generally integrate QoL features unless they have broad support.

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mikeprichard
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by mikeprichard » Sat Jul 20, 2019 10:04 pm

Interkarma wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 10:01 pm
If DF was an original creation of my own, I'd personally do away with interaction modes altogether. I floated this idea during early development and feedback was majority in support for keeping them like classic.
Really?? So sad... you probably remember I've been advocating for an option to do away with the whole "interaction modes" mess in favor of an intuitive/convenient left-click/right-click interaction system, and now I see you also personally favor getting rid of the modes, at least optionally. IMO that would be the single biggest improvement for DFU over classic Daggerfall (in the same class as "click to attack"). This would also address the specific issue raised here, as well as countless other frustrations I've encountered in my own gameplay and witnessed in others' Daggerfall gameplay videos. Any chance we can do a recount? :)

Copying my old suggestion from this topic (viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1042) for reference:
OPTIONAL SETTING: Interaction Modes replaced with left-click (talk/use/open/loot), right-click (info), sneak (stealing)

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Interkarma
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by Interkarma » Sat Jul 20, 2019 10:16 pm

I know Mike, I generally feel the same way. I'd love some more thought around interaction modes someday. For now I'm just letting this one percolate.

For what it's worth, I'm definitely happy that DFU matches classic by default. I'd just like to see an alternative method or mod for this eventually.

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mikeprichard
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by mikeprichard » Sat Jul 20, 2019 10:26 pm

Sure, I completely understand the priority needs to remain parity with classic, particularly up to 1.0, and my appreciation for DFU is huge regardless of what happens. But I hope this "percolation" really picks up steam - my personal DFU experience would be 1,000 times more enjoyable if the interaction modes could be put on the trash heap for most modern players, while remaining available for the likely minority of players who grew up with classic and its take on the bad old 1990s game control schemes.

You've at least given me hope that 1) changing the modes is technically possible, and 2) I'm not alone in thinking they're, uh... not great. Thanks!

Teralitha
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by Teralitha » Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:58 pm

A checkbox on the launcher for the requested QOL change would be nice. But its not like I cant live without it. I can see rogue type player characters wanting to leave pilfer on for extended amounts of time not wanting to have it on, and I can also see player characters that are not into thieving and getting arrested by accident would prefer to have the checkbox on. And if someone decides to change up their play style they can just check/uncheck the box.

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jayhova
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by jayhova » Sun Jul 21, 2019 12:10 am

Teralitha wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 4:02 pm
Pressing a button to switch between grab and pilfer(to not having to press the button) is a fundamental change? You prefer getting jailed and losing rep just because you forgot to change it after leaving a dungeon? This is indeed a QOL change. I think you just wanted to get me to look at your glossary ;P
Well Yes. :D

But as has been said what you are proposing changes the mechanics of how the game is played. You might think it dumb and many would agree. However, it's a primary mechanic in the daggerfall that the game has multiple modes and you switch between those modes. This mechanic was dropped in favor of other things later in the series. But the purpose of making DFU is not to rebuild the game as it would be made now, but to make it work now as it did then.

I myself have proposed a means of using custom crosshair icons as a means of indicating what action the PC is about to take in a fashion similar to OpenMW. The much later games in the series used animated crosshairs to indicate how effective you were at sneaking. However I suggested it as a semi-official mod (similar to the mouse pointer replacement) where the user would add icons to indicate actions on mouseover or rather X-hair over. This seems like a mod since it does change how the game is played.
Remember always 'What would Julian Do?'.
Windows 10 Pro 64 bit. DFU Ver. Alpha 0.10.7

Teralitha
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Re: Quality Of Life Upgrade Request

Post by Teralitha » Sun Jul 21, 2019 12:22 am

Doesnt change it THAT much

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