Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

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Ommamar
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Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by Ommamar » Thu Aug 01, 2019 4:12 am

Is there any way to break down stacks of arrows? I am curious the weight of a single arrow, I have seen arrows on merchant shelves that appear to be a single arrow but when I buy them they magically seem to turn in to ten arrows.

The next part is just an opinion query what is your preferred flavor of mage light?

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Interkarma
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by Interkarma » Thu Aug 01, 2019 4:52 am

You can hold down Ctrl key and "remove" an arrow stack to split stack and just remove a single arrow. Their weight is 0.25kg apiece or 8.81 oz. This is a really heavy arrow! But it's pretty standard video game logic (in before someone mentions bobby pins). Arrow weights are from the item templates data extracted from FALL.EXE.

My preferred Mage Light variant is Inferno. Love that low red glow.

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pango
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by pango » Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:20 am

Arrows have no effective weight though:
https://github.com/Interkarma/daggerfal ... em.cs#L635:

Code: Select all

        // Horses, carts and arrows are not counted against encumbrance.
        public float EffectiveUnitWeightInKg()
        {
            if (ItemGroup == ItemGroups.Transportation || TemplateIndex == (int)Weapons.Arrow)
                return 0f;
            return weightInKg;
        }
I was surprised by that, but it actually matches classic Daggerfall behavior.
When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
-- Charles Goodhart

Ommamar
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by Ommamar » Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:21 am

Interkarma wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 4:52 am
You can hold down Ctrl key and "remove" an arrow stack to split stack and just remove a single arrow. Their weight is 0.25kg apiece or 8.81 oz. This is a really heavy arrow! But it's pretty standard video game logic (in before someone mentions bobby pins). Arrow weights are from the item templates data extracted from FALL.EXE.

My preferred Mage Light variant is Inferno. Love that low red glow.
Thanks for the info, yes the stacks stuck me as being heavy so I was wondering what the weight of a single one is.

I prefer Storm as it gives kind of blueish silver light.

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Interkarma
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by Interkarma » Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:22 am

pango wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:20 am
Arrows have no effective weight though:
That's right! I had forgotten that exchange. Cheers. :)

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Hazelnut
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by Hazelnut » Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:50 am

I always rationalise the arrow weight not counting against player encumbrance as being because they are in a quiver, which makes perfect sense... if you squint. If it were not for following classic, I would have given arrows a more realistic weight and left them counting against encumbrance (like they did originally in DFU) but the consequence is that archers have quite the weight penalty just for carrying their ammo, so for the sake of DF as a game I think matching classic is a good solution. Main thing that bothers me is that players have to notice that arrows do not count since they are given weight in the UI info.

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mikeprichard
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by mikeprichard » Thu Aug 01, 2019 11:18 am

Hazelnut wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:50 am
Main thing that bothers me is that players have to notice that arrows do not count since they are given weight in the UI info.
Is the UI something that could be fixed, or is it baked in (I'm afraid it's the latter)? Naturally, it is very confusing.

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Hazelnut
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by Hazelnut » Thu Aug 01, 2019 12:08 pm

It matches classic and I don't feel this is somewhere DFU should diverge.

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mikeprichard
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by mikeprichard » Thu Aug 01, 2019 3:06 pm

OK - seems to be perfect territory for a base DFU bugfix to me, similar to others already done (the UI is clearly wrong), but as usual I'm not the one doing the coding, so whatever works!

Ommamar
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Re: Weight of an Arrow and favorite mage light flavor

Post by Ommamar » Thu Aug 01, 2019 4:51 pm

Hazelnut wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:50 am
I always rationalise the arrow weight not counting against player encumbrance as being because they are in a quiver, which makes perfect sense... if you squint. If it were not for following classic, I would have given arrows a more realistic weight and left them counting against encumbrance (like they did originally in DFU) but the consequence is that archers have quite the weight penalty just for carrying their ammo, so for the sake of DF as a game I think matching classic is a good solution. Main thing that bothers me is that players have to notice that arrows do not count since they are given weight in the UI info.
The only way I figured that out was while playing a no magic build that also had no potions I was trying to drop enough stuff to be able to swim. I saw the arrows weight in the UI but when I dropped them there was no adjustment nor was there any when I picked them up. I understand why they are implemented as they are but it would make sense for them to have weight then actually have an equitable quiver that reduces their weight. Of course I don't think they should way .25kg a piece maybe 1kg for a bundle of ten would be reasonable.

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