Real Time ray tracing

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mtrredux
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Real Time ray tracing

Post by mtrredux » Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:56 am

I have seen a few different cases where RTRT was used in a classic game
for example
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrq1T93uLag
Is this possible for daggerfall unity...does unity support RTRT?

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King of Worms
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by King of Worms » Sun Jul 28, 2019 4:24 am

:? So u cant run it on 2080ti?
Would be good promo for nvidia. DFU becomming the 5th game supporting this awesome technology, nobody uses ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚ maybe ask nvidia if they want to throw few milions on Interkarma so he implements it

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Interkarma
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by Interkarma » Sun Jul 28, 2019 5:13 am

Just here to confirm that Unity supports real-time ray tracing and I will happily implement for millions. :D

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mtrredux
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by mtrredux » Sun Jul 28, 2019 5:51 am

Interkarma wrote: โ†‘
Sun Jul 28, 2019 5:13 am
Just here to confirm that Unity supports real-time ray tracing and I will happily implement for millions. :D
Wouldn't you have to use a different API instead of DX11?

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mtrredux
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by mtrredux » Sun Jul 28, 2019 6:02 am

King of Worms wrote: โ†‘
Sun Jul 28, 2019 4:24 am
:? So u cant run it on 2080ti?
Would be good promo for nvidia. DFU becomming the 5th game supporting this awesome technology, nobody uses ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚ maybe ask nvidia if they want to throw few milions on Interkarma so he implements it
It would also be a good promo for DFU...also I don't think you would need an RTX card for Daggerfall with RTRT.
Just a good GPU.

Firebrand
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by Firebrand » Sun Jul 28, 2019 9:18 am

mtrredux wrote: โ†‘
Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:56 am
I have seen a few different cases where RTRT was used in a classic game
for example
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrq1T93uLag
It would be super cool to have something like this in DFU ๐Ÿ˜ฎ๐Ÿ˜ฎ๐Ÿ˜ฎ

Narf the Mouse
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by Narf the Mouse » Sun Jul 28, 2019 9:24 am

Ray-tracing will probably start becoming a real thing with RTX 3X00 cards, and possibly with whatever AMD releases post-5X00. I won't even try to guess at a name. So, 2022 at the latest is very likely.

Although Intel is a wildcard here. A realistic estimate is probably good mid-range cards, but... we have basically no real info.

The long and short of it is that ray-tracing in the RTX 2X00 cards uses non-optimal math, non-optimal techniques, and basically suffers from "Gen 1"-type problems, as well as a lack of sufficient hardware to do more than run it on reflecting surfaces (small amount of GPU area).

Ideally, the entire scene would be ray-traced, but for AAA games, that is likely to be RTX 4X00 minimum. RTX 3X00 will likely still use a mix of traditional "faked" lighting and ray-tracing, just with a sizable jump in the amount that gets ray-traced.

Referencing the Quake 1 ray-tracing mod:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vY0W3MkZFs4

It has only simple rooms and creatures to render, and does so at not-that-great speeds. But the situation is better than it sounds; mesh complexity adds a sub-linear amount of slowdown. The major, and linear, slowdown comes from the number of bounces, which mesh complexity can only influence.

Or to tl;dr - The Quake 1 ray-tracing mod is only a little faster than Battlefield V is slow. :)

RTX 3X00 means more ray-tracing capability, and as a new tech, ray-tracing is likely to develop quickly. In particular, all the math has already been done. Hollywood uses this all the time, and while people like to snark about "CGI", I imagine those same people happily watch every single Marvel movie. :P ;) With a relatively small area dedicated to ray-tracing in the RTX 2X00 cards, there is plenty of room to grow. :)

My prediction, then: With RTX 5X00, ray-tracing will become "The way to play games."
Previous experience tells me it's very easy to misunderstand the tone, intent, or meaning of what I've posted. If you have questions, ask.

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pango
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by pango » Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:44 pm

I found this article to be very good at debunking a lot of myths around this technique (like "Hollywood is using ray tracing"; they actually use it sparingly, rasterization is still the norm for good reasons):
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ra ... ,2351.html
When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
-- Charles Goodhart

Narf the Mouse
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by Narf the Mouse » Sun Jul 28, 2019 8:25 pm

pango wrote: โ†‘
Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:44 pm
I found this article to be very good at debunking a lot of myths around this technique (like "Hollywood is using ray tracing"; they actually use it sparingly, rasterization is still the norm for good reasons):
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ra ... ,2351.html
"...July 22, 2009 at 1:00 AM" - Your info might be a bit outdated. :)
Previous experience tells me it's very easy to misunderstand the tone, intent, or meaning of what I've posted. If you have questions, ask.

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King of Worms
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Re: Real Time ray tracing

Post by King of Worms » Sun Jul 28, 2019 8:38 pm

Im not against progress, but from what Ive read from developers of games, RayTracing is very usefull... to make rasterization look good :lol:
ATM they ray trace the scene, and adjust rasterization to match the ray tracing results. That gives em 90% of the look with like 10% of the computing power needed.

Dont get me wrong, I know RayTracing is the future, I know it since 1st 3DStudio I used back in 90s, and we are getting there.

So yea, if those rays hit the DFU, Im all in.. I just.. dont ride the hype wagon atm (and I dont mean it like this thread is about hype)

PS: and to be honest, RTX cards to me are almost a scam atm, they hype you for raytracing, than almost a year laters, there are no raytraced games (5 I guess) ANd you payed a BIG premium for those cores, sitting there, iddling... plus anything below 2080ti is basically unusable for some decent raytracing.. so.. yeah.. meh :lol:

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