facepalm

[Baler]

Interkarma you have a track record of locking threads. KoW didn't get upset simply because of that ONE thread.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_tha ... mel's_back

[Azteca]

I don’t know what you hope to accomplish with this post. I’m sure Interkarma literally understands that KoW didn’t like the thread being locked. He explained his reasons why (namely, there is no inalienable right to be rude to someone on the forum for their years-long passion project) and locked it as every viewpoint had already been aired.
Every other forum I’m on would have banned someone calling the admin names without blinking an eye. Instead, mods and admin here are expected to leave threads open so people can insult them endlessly? No, the purpose of the forum is to facilitate discussion and development. If that comes at the expense of basic respect and a spirit of collaboration, most of us don’t want it.
I really don’t think it’s that complicated. I would never carry on a conversation in person with someone who cursed at me like that, and I’d scoff at someone insisting I allow people to talk to me like that in my establishment. Again, he’s not even banned, the conversations were just stopped because they weren’t going to be productive.

[Baler]

accomplish?

I know i'm going to be told this is an attempt to incite drama. Which it isn't. And that if I want to be a part of this community I need to be civil and respectful. Which I am.

Good day.

Sorry im not going to read your paragraph.

[Interkarma]

I'm not sure what you thought you would accomplish here either. This is just creating drama for drama's sake. It's exactly what I mean by disturbing the peace.

Edit: You know what, I'm going to leave this one open for now. I know perfectly well that Baler is baiting me here, but I'm interested in hearing from others. Let me know if you want posts like these on the forums and I'll relax moderation. If the sentiment doesn't swing that way, I'll close it. Have at it guys, just be respectful and avoid personal insults.

[DigitalMonk]

I think lockdown must be getting to us, because some of this isn't making sense...

Baler: I know you're reasonable, because I just re-read your posts on the original thread where you supported Interkarma and Jay. I also see that you want to be fair and open-minded to all participants, because of your "third way" and pointing out that more, ahem, "spirited" discussions can move to the discord server. So when you say something, I respect you and I want to listen and understand.

In mutual respect, I hope you will pause and reflect on the wording you chose in the opening of this thread, and see how it can easily be interpreted as hostile and dramatic, regardless of your original intent. Likewise, "I'm not reading your paragraph" is uncharacteristically close-minded of you, and unlike your reasoned responses elsewhere.

I think we're all succumbing to the stress of what's going on out in the world, and we're trying to carry on normally, but sometimes that stress explodes in strange ways. "The final straw," indeed, though I think the preceding straws have been more to do with coronavirus/politics/economics/warfare/injustice than anything that's actually happening here in these forums. But we can't control that world out there, so we try to pour our influence into the smaller things that we think we should be able to control, like the forums where we hang out to talk about our favorite hobbies.

On the whole, I don't think there's much else to say about any of this. It's not even censorship, because the threads are left in place even when locked, and moderators are only locking threads, not banning users. But now we're all sensitive, and starting to fall into entrenched positions, and that only makes things worse / more volatile. So, perhaps we all need a weekend of deep breathing interspersed with deep dungeon crawls to work out tension, and try coming back next week more refreshed...

[BadLuckBurt]

I can do without them. Its clear Baler doesnt want a discussion or anything constructive to happen which is a shame.

[DigitalMonk]

Edit: You know what, I'm going to leave this one open for now. I know perfectly well that Baler is baiting me here, but I'm interested in hearing from others. Let me know if you want posts like these on the forums and I'll relax moderation. If the sentiment doesn't swing that way, I'll close it. Have at it guys, just be respectful and avoid personal insults.

Personally, I have no patience for uncivil discourse. On my forums, the banhammer is on a very light trigger... But that's my house and my rules and people are always free on the greater Internet to call me anything they want, so I don't feel any particular remorse. I can admit when I've done or said something wrong or just stupid, and things can be rectified without descending into name calling and patronizing, so people who don't understand basic civility are simply removed from my life.

I understand the concern of the slippery slope, and "well, are you going to start locking my threads or banning me just because you didn't like something I said?" That has happened elsewhere, and it's a valid concern. But I don't see evidence of it happening here. People aren't being banned. New threads can be started without moderation. Specific dead-end / dead-horse threads get locked, but they don't get edited or removed.

This should be a happy forum for people to share their love of DF and DFU. Call me a hippie (which, if you knew me, you wouldn't do...), but I don't see any reason for bile and acid on these forums...

[mikeprichard]

Although I'm ironically taking Baler's bait by posting in this topic, I also say: let's just move on. Some people may be going through some psychological stress that may leave them somewhat unbalanced, especially these days. No need to compound the issue further with pointless added-drama topics like this. Interkarma, feel free to lock and eventually even ban people when you see fit. I've been following this forum for years, and not once have I ever seen Interkarma or Jay_H behave other than professionally and civilly, including with the recent *individual* who barged into the forums to spread his/her arrogant obnoxious nonsense and bile. People like that have cropped up on the forums every few months and mercifully usually left on their own after a while (I'm not going to name names, but I have a couple from the past year in mind), but Interkarma has shown almost infinite patience in the face of stubborn, rude incompetence.

If I were an admin, I'd lock this foolishness immediately whenever it came up. No need to tolerate such idiocy in an area I can control when there's so much of it elsewhere in real life.

[Interkarma]

I think we're all succumbing to the stress of what's going on out in the world, and we're trying to carry on normally, but sometimes that stress explodes in strange ways. "The final straw," indeed, though I think the preceding straws have been more to do with coronavirus/politics/economics/warfare/injustice than anything that's actually happening here in these forums. But we can't control that world out there, so we try to pour our influence into the smaller things that we think we should be able to control, like the forums where we hang out to talk about our favorite hobbies.

On the whole, I don't think there's much else to say about any of this. It's not even censorship, because the threads are left in place even when locked, and moderators are only locking threads, not banning users. But now we're all sensitive, and starting to fall into entrenched positions, and that only makes things worse / more volatile. So, perhaps we all need a weekend of deep breathing interspersed with deep dungeon crawls to work out tension, and try coming back next week more refreshed...

Yeah, excellent point. Everyone on the planet is under a huge amount of stress right now. That's going to come out in all kinds of strange ways.

Baler, I apologise for saying you were baiting me. It's OK for you to raise frustrations with me in a reasonable manner. But did you have to use Comic Sans? I mean come on man, that's a fighting font.

[numidium3rd]

To be fair, the locked thread in question was becoming a pile-on towards ForAllDanKind near the end (I'll admit to being part of it). I don't see how it could've been constructive to go on from there.