The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

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Midknightprince
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The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by Midknightprince » Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:27 pm

So currently with some pretty steady gameplay ( albeit I'm a hardcore gamer), you can Max your skills and stats in a week, and most of the enemies are pretty much trivial if you have the right weapons and your using everything right.

I'm thinking maybe lower the skill rate increase, maybe a slider if it can be done, right now level 5 and 6 are like a blip on the radar the way I play, and level 12 is not far off...
Just something I've noticed playing this thing, you can Max your dude out in no time, and there is a lot of fun gameplay fighting stuff at level 5 through 10 ( when the weapon requirements to hit stuff start kicking in).

It would be cool to make this thing harder for those who see fitt....
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Jay_H
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by Jay_H » Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:18 am

Enemy data is found in https://github.com/Interkarma/daggerfal ... yBasics.cs. I'd hope a mod would be able to elevate enemy health, armor, speed, and attack appropriately ;)

Ommamar
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by Ommamar » Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:51 am

I think Daggerfall more then any other game in the series allowed you to build incredibly strong characters by mid level which some liked but I think the majority would agree with Midknightprince it can trivialize the game. One option I could see would be to have another dagger window to adjust a buff to the enemies that would also move the leveling dagger down as you moved the enemies level up. It could be in increments of 10% to 100% which would adjust the mentioned attributes shown on github, of course you would want this to be accessible through the players menu as it could make the beginning of the game very difficult but would be useful once you had gained some power.

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pango
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by pango » Wed Aug 21, 2019 6:36 am

A way to fix this without changing the game itself (because there are many loopholes in Daggerfall) is to do "challenge" builds.
By that I mean, thru character creation and/or rules of conduct, decide not to use some powerful behaviors.
It's up to you to make the game harder :)

@Vondur is currently doing a run where he uses no magicka (only potions), with more builds to come.
Grimmith did a lot of challenge runs: characters without magicka ("nojazz" run), linguist class (all first 9 skills are language skills), not harming humans (Storm Bull run, if I remember correctly)...
Many predefined classes could be considered challenge classes, given how few advantages they have ;)

If you lack ideas for things to try, has anyone started a list of such challenges?
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Hazelnut
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by Hazelnut » Wed Aug 21, 2019 9:03 am

Basically stop being such minmaxing munchkins! :lol:

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Jay_H
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by Jay_H » Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:39 pm

Ahh, that's like when you can beat everyone at a game and someone tells you, "Just play easier!" :lol: There's a real thrill when you give everything you have at a game you love and barely make it through. Dynamic difficulty would do us well! :)

Ommamar
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by Ommamar » Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:29 pm

pango wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 6:36 am
A way to fix this without changing the game itself (because there are many loopholes in Daggerfall) is to do "challenge" builds.
By that I mean, thru character creation and/or rules of conduct, decide not to use some powerful behaviors.
It's up to you to make the game harder :)

@Vondur is currently doing a run where he uses no magicka (only potions), with more builds to come.
Grimmith did a lot of challenge runs: characters without magicka ("nojazz" run), linguist class (all first 9 skills are language skills), not harming humans (Storm Bull run, if I remember correctly)...
Many predefined classes could be considered challenge classes, given how few advantages they have ;)

If you lack ideas for things to try, has anyone started a list of such challenges?
Well I am doing a pacifist build with a heavy focus on languages and illusion magic which is quite difficult. I take find item/person quests a lot. The concept is I can't do any lasting harm to anything so I can use pacify type spells, paralyze or sleep spells and illusion to get away.

I also have a none magic build but it seems to find a ridiculous amount of potions and enchanted items so it isn't to hard. Especially since I have gotten him to a point in a temple where he can purchase potions. I am considering one that won't use any magic items or potions as well as one that can't go in the sunlight.

There are ways to make the game harder but I can also see a desire for someone who wants to make a strong build have a way to adjust the difficulty as they go along.

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pango
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by pango » Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:34 am

Ommamar wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:29 pm
There are ways to make the game harder but I can also see a desire for someone who wants to make a strong build have a way to adjust the difficulty as they go along.
Unleveled world could help, you'd have to pick fights on your own.
But I'm not sure what's the best way to extend the game once you're so powerful that you no longer fear any enemy. Many solutions look like "flight forwards" to me.
When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
-- Charles Goodhart

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pango
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Re: The more difficult Daggerfall mod suggestion

Post by pango » Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:51 am

Thinking of it, if I had to make Daggerfall more difficult, I'd make enemies more resilient in general, but with more pronounced weaknesses (to elements, types of weapons,...) so as to make combat more tactical.
And build choices would matter more.
When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
-- Charles Goodhart

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