[0.13.5] Player can add both variants of light or darkness powered magery [RESOLVED 0.14]

[Ralzar]

Just discovered you can do this:

exploit.png (393.77 KiB) Viewed 1131 times

This gives you both the disadvantage points from "lower" AND from "unable". So you are getting rewarded twice without an increase in the disadvantage.

Easiest solution would be to not let them both be in the list at the same time right?

[Interkarma]

I raised this one a while back, and I ultimately closed issue after discussion was derailed.

viewtopic.php?t=1709

I'll move this one to Issues and take another look.

[Magicono43]

I raised this one a while back, and I ultimately closed issue after discussion was derailed.

viewtopic.php?t=1709

I'll move this one to Issues and take another look.

Next I get the opportunity, I'm probably going to make a mod that attempts to re-allow some of the DOS exploits that were fixed in DFU. Not because I have any attachment to these exploits but just so it can be linked whenever the argument ever comes up, lol. "You want the old exploits back? Fine, just use this mod, now what's your argument again?"

[billyloist]

That's a good solution I think. I've seen some people being actually upset that they can no longer make High Elf supermen being immune to everything like the good old days. Makes me miss glass cannon High Elves from Morrowind

[Ralzar]

I raised this one a while back, and I ultimately closed issue after discussion was derailed.

viewtopic.php?t=1709

I'll move this one to Issues and take another look.

Next I get the opportunity, I'm probably going to make a mod that attempts to re-allow some of the DOS exploits that were fixed in DFU. Not because I have any attachment to these exploits but just so it can be linked whenever the argument ever comes up, lol. "You want the old exploits back? Fine, just use this mod, now what's your argument again?"

Can't you just link Daggerfall on Steam?

[Seferoth]

Cant we leave this one alone? I use this a lot...and if it's same in classic then we could leave it alone. If not i would also like a mod to restore this exploit.

[Jay_H]

There's no question this is unintended behavior in Daggerfall. I made a list of the point benefits gained from each of these disadvantages: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Daggerfall_Mod ... advantages

Darkness-Powered Magery:
Lower Magic Ability in Daylight: -7
Unable to Use Magic in Daylight: -10

Inability to Regen Magicka: -14

Light-Powered Magery:
Lower Magic Ability in Darkness: -10
Unable to Use Magic in Darkness: -14

Minor nuances aside, "Inability to Regen Magicka" is almost functionally the same as "Unable to Use Magic in Darkness," but everywhere. The game inexplicably assigns them the same point benefit in each case, which should not be so; "Inability to Regen Magicka" should probably give an even greater point benefit, but that's outside our scope here.

The point is, being able to nearly triple the point benefit and receive no compensating disadvantage cannot possibly be Daggerfall's intent.

[Seferoth]

It's not a bug so it does not need to be fixed. This exploit can be avoided by simply not using it. Not every exploit needs fixing, only those that are unavoidable.

[XJDHDR]

It's not a bug so it does not need to be fixed. This exploit ...

exploit [ verb ik-sploit; noun eks-ploit, ik-sploit ]
(in a video game) the use of a bug or flaw in game design to a player’s advantage or to the disadvantage of other players.

So arguing that this is an exploit, but also not a bug is contradictory.

And no, DFU's stance has always been to fix bugs in the base game's code (if not never introduce the buggy behaviour to begin with). That a bug can be avoided has never, to my knowledge, been a justification for keeping it in.
If you want this to remain in the game, you're welcome to present proof that this isn't a bug.

Minor nuances aside, "Inability to Regen Magicka" is almost functionally the same as "Unable to Use Magic in Darkness," but everywhere. The game inexplicably assigns them the same point benefit in each case, which should not be so; "Inability to Regen Magicka" should probably give an even greater point benefit, but that's outside our scope here.

I'm not so sure that I agree. "Inability to Regen Magicka" just means that you can't rest to replenish magicka. You can still cast spells after drinking a Restore Power potion. Conversely, there is no potion or enchantment in the game that will negate an "Unable to Use Magic in Darkness" disadvantage.

[Interkarma]

As this topic appears to going the way of the last one, I've made a decision to fix this bug. From 0.14, player can only add one variant of light or darkness disadvantage each.

Thank you everyone for your input.